Some general points about van building.
There are quite a few swivel seat makers. They are all pretty much overpriced, they are also pretty much going to increase the height of the seats (I don't want that) and so to mitigate that you'd need to lower the pedestal, which is another cost to the seat. Ugh!
Changing the oil, this is the easiest car to oil change apparently. To reset, Turn ignition to 'On' and press gas pedal 3 times within a 30 second time frame.
If you use good oil, can help keep the vehicle in top shape.
Initially I thougth some foam insulation, ISO foam I think it's called and then maybe a layer of 3/4 plywood was the way to do it. Now though, after I've seen some other builds I think maybe some foam and then some rubber, then some carpet may be the way. Obviously if I'm hauling something, I may need to provide some floor protection against drag.
One example build that as really intriguing included some information on flooring. A company makes a ribbed carpet floor for the promaster. It looks like the Promaster 2500 136 is supported. The site is called VanRug. Cost of the rug comes out at 216. The guy mentioned when his rug arrived, he used the rug AS a template for cutting the rest of the pieces of his flooring. Which is amazing.
Humble Road has some interesting stuff on flooring. He was doing a Ford or Sprinter van and he went with a method of creating joists from aluminum square tube, running those perpendicular from the floor's ribbing, then between the joists he's saying use polyiso foam (in the video he used a cheaper foam polystyrene, but nevertheless). Polyiso according to Humble Road is more hydrophobic and easier to cut and has better r-value.
How did he do this and with what products?
An important note he gave. When going around the wheel well remember the wheel wells taper upwards. Which means if you cut all your materials to the fattest part of the taper you're introducing a gap. So get all your layers built up and do your cutouts. This will mean a tighter better fit, less gap.
the problem with this floor method is it does not allow for floor tie downs unless you worked around them. Everything is covered. Since he glued down all the foam, and then glued the plywood on top. it's super stable, but the chances of getting underneath, adding a tie down, not going to happen. So tiedowns would have to happen at the corners or some other method such as from an internal skeleton. The other problem is there's going to be a challenge if you wanted to route cable through it lengthwise, since the square tubing would block it. HOWEVER, you could run smaller cable within the lower part of the floor ribbing as that's an air gap also you could drill some holes in the aluminum tube, and cables could run through. Let's say you had two layers of polyiso you could run cable through part of it an used multiple layers of the foam to help you create cable channels. Find out what gauge cable would be necessary. Maybe pretty thin, but plan on adding some thing to protect the cable getting cut on the aluminum. Plastic bushings or something like that.
I've linked inanother place about using lightweight bamboo mat as a ceiling material, which might be fantastic in every way. But revisiting an old favorite video showed the retired engineer's van build, Davd Orton used 80/20 and he also mixed carpeted walls but also a thick coroplast for celing and some wall material.
In another forum link somebody mentioned using expanded PVC sheet as good ceiling material.
It's entirely possible that coroplast could dent easily and be too soft, HOWEVER it would be extremely light weight and since part of insulation is pockets of air, potentially could be used as between layers, and maybe dents could be prevented if the right thickness is found of coroplast both in plastic density and the fluting size.
Corplast is water proof, it bends, it's long lasting. It cuts, it's reasonably inexpensive, it's light, there are not fibers to fray unlike say a natural material, no splintering, aside from sharp edges or problems your own cuts created. Some have said there are fire retardant variations. it can be glued or screwed or riveted (sort of) and it is springy and soft, and it doesn't really squeak either and it's springiness could be an asset to hold fasteners to itself using material tension.
Home depot has large sheets of clear and black coroplast and you can get pack of 10 large sheets 48×96 for $200. That's pretty affordable.
another possible good choice for ceilings. It's not absurdly heavy or thick and it will be bendable and easy to clean. Home depot even has some fun colors. Since it's not getting the UV rays inside the van that it would as an actual roof material, it should maintain flexibility for a longer duration too.
Interesting example of framing where the unsquare upper corner work is handled quite well.
There may be some good constraints that could be used when building out the van. Normally constraints aren't considered 'good' but they can be helpful rather than choosing arbitrary sizes, heights, distances. Case in point. If you build side benches that can be for storage and also to fit over the wheel well, you might consider that those could be used as supports for a bed frame. And that height might be the basis for the height of other things you plan to build. Saw horses, could support the bed in the middle, so you'd want those heights to match. In terms of creating cabinetry, think about using the same mounting points as the van structure but also look to see if those might coincide with something else common, perhaps like wall studs where they'd be 16 inches on center.
Look at the height of things in terms of how you will be able to use, mount, dismount and put away. If you want to know how high a bed should be, or some other piece of furniture kit, stationary or moveable, think about matching something else, but also look at how you, or somebody smaller than you will be able to get in, use and get out of that 'area'. A high bed might mean you can get a lot of storage underneath but it also means that you need step up and step downs to access it. It might also mean hanging a hammock is more difficult.
One youtuber is a mountainbiker and he's got an interesting setup with a similar layout (bed in back on platform) as others BUT he's got a lot more open space, which was kind of intriguing.
He's got a toolbox coming out on a heavy drawer slide, WITH a Park Tools bike stand mounted to it. He's got an air compressor hose fitting at the outside of the van as well.
This youtuber's bed frame was using steel rails, a kind of C channel steel and from there, some other square tube framing was attached, which left it VERY flexible to under mount things too, and of course being magnetic and strong steel, it should work quite well versatile and have great longevity.
Storage and cabinets. A big concern is weight and durability. Also security in some cases. One idea could be to add lockers to the right. There is a company that makes HDPE plastic lockers which are not light but might be useful in the rig, or worth looking at.
L-Track is a logistical track that's been adapted by the airline industry for seating. L-Track is has a very high strength (in the thousands of pounds break strength) and a fittings and fasteners that work with l-track can fasten every 1 inch. It's smaller track than E-Track and lighter weight aluminum.
I had been pondering using L-Track for mounting cabinets in the van to the wall so they could be added and removed on demand and make the cargo area modular. After I went into the Fenton shop United Access I now know that there are use cases for l-track and fastening seating to the floor. Wheel chairs are fastened to vans using l-track, with hooks on the chairs and their seatbelts are also mounted to the floor and wall using l-track. This and the fact that airplane seating is using it means that l-track can handle the weight and, could it be argued that it's not tested?
One of the possibilities of outfitting a van, in the case of say the bed is to locate it and give it structural strength, but keep it light weight and removeable. This example shown below is somebody's idea of using IKEA metal bed slats, fastening them to both sides of the wall using a coupling inside L-Track system.
http://livelikepete.com/sprinter-van-diy-3-panel-platform-bed-on-l-track/
Because the bed slats are light and have holes, and because the parts can separate so well, the person also used other locator threaded pins on the wall to Fasten the pieces when not in use. This seems like a VERY cool way to get around the permanence issue. It's not like the bed HAS to be changed often but the option to do it, AND to continue to stow the pieces away when you need all the cargo room is VERY interesting. So far, this looks like potentially either the best or second best way to do a build. Competing with the guy that has his bed pieces fold down on his table accomodating for a lot of bench guest seating. Could all of that still work? Maybe!\
the e-track and L-track methods of fastening things to the van presents an interesting possibility in regards to outfitting the van. So many people map out the van build and have storage above the bed in back, and that storage of cabinets up high makes sense for living in the van and storing a lot of stuff.
HOWEVER…. a good fastening method like L-track or E-track presents the idea of having a soft storage overhead bin. Instead of hanging cabinets up there, might there be a hanging soft partitioned set of containers that could serve the same purpose, putting clothes or personal items up there. It's certainly not as home-y a feeling, but they also are probably lighter and could be a good interim solution. Including retaining the ability to hang clothing too.
Ever since my friend Sherrid told me how he strings a hammock across the corners of his Jeep to sleep in, I've been in love with the idea. There are adventure eye-bolts that I can attach inside the van.
I remember seeing a cargo net in a movie, used in an airplane to separate areas the strapping is so strong that heavy things aren't able to shift and pass through areas very well. It's a net. I thought about this for making a sort of cargo net partition. Turns out somebody already thought of it. If the right material is attached to the cargo net, concievably the cab could be partitioned from the cargo area and the sound could be mitigated, temperature might be mitigated as well.
One van owner, David Orton in California took a non-traditional approach to framing out the van. Instead of large full pieces of wood he's utilizing a flexible framing method using 80/20 extrusions. The 1.5 inch square aluminum 80/20 extrusions allow for a 5/16th carriage bolt to fasten to it and allow for things along the framing to be attached. This includes bolting on removeable pieces of furniture, but also allows for inserting tiedowns and other things, PROVIDED that you can get your carriage bolt slid from the end of the extruded rod. If you can't get access to the end, you will NOT be able to get a carriage bolt in there. There are other methods, potentially there are quick insert anchors, but I don't know at this time what they are.
Dave Orton's website, being that he's a retired engineer, has full CAD layouts for his Ford Transit. Photos are also there that show his framing of the floor grid of the 80/20. The layout also allows him to run electric under through areas on the floor. Understanding this will require a few viewings.
Zoro website to purchased 8020 seems like a pretty good price for lenghts of say 72 inches at 90 inches.
This guy in some ways thinks a lot like I do. Entire series of videos using 8020 where he discusses connections, modifying them to fit for cabinest.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfK4SDDFkrI
Things I've learned… 1/4 plywood can fit in the slots of 8020. There are some rounded slide in nuts that don't require access to the far edge of the 8020 so you can put it where you want. When drilling through, use a stop color so you don't drill through anything else. Catch metal shavings with a magnet, pain the extra drilled holes to prevent rust. He uses fiber glass angles so he doesn't conduct the heat between two sets of metal.
Kee Klamps have a 2000 lb pull out strength. They are costly but the pipe is likely going to come in cheaper than 8020 would. Consider a mix of these structural elements such as 8020, Kee Klamp or MakerPipe.
Contrasting Kee Klamps, a framework in between that and the thinner EMT conduit is the FlexPipe system.
The mountain biker recommended a solar channel and is alwasy recommending as the best batteries out there, the “Battle Born” 100 amp hour 12 volt LiFePO4 batteries.
You can get a 100 or 180 watt solar panel by Grape Solar at Home Depot, so it's not like everything requires going through difficult channels to get supplied with electrical options.
Guy who specifically discusses solar power and brings in something like 1100 watts of solar and can power a 33 amp window AC unit to cool his RV trailer off in Yuma AZ in the middle of summer. He has 3 150lb batteries over the trailer axel, his batteries are actually absorbing the excess electrical energy when running his stuff because his solar panels are bringing in so much. He mentions that he follows what his system asks him to do and following the instructions has kept it running optimally for years on a consistent basis.
Good solar video video that shows mounting uni-strut bar to promaster as a roof rack then connecting two 300 watt Renogi panels, and then a glossed over portion for the connection.
There are a lot of commercially available and expensive racks. For vans, they seem to be as overpriced as they get. But there are other options, some budget options without a lot of fabrication. Especially if you don't need a full surround rack but instead just need to hold some solar panels in the center. You can use steel or aluminum strut and that will give you fasteners that can side wherever you need them along the channel. Strut is durable and relatively affordable depending on the size, length and material.
Just from a blurb from a video I heard, Cradlepoint is a provider that does internet for patrol cars, things like that so as a leader in that space, potentially mobile internet options could be looked in there.
A van life expert hermit talks about the best propane heater for a van. One problem with heaters is too much heat because a van, when it's too hot, you'll want to shut off the heat, then it will cool off again and it's better to have something running the entire time but at a lower temperature. Now that presents a question about the performance of the heater in an uninsulated van, will it be enough as a transitional item before my insulation job is done. We'll see!
A diesel heater is a pretty popular item now. According to users you can set the heater on low, and it slowly sips fuel, so the plastic diesel tank can last a long time. It comes as a kit and has digital readout. The problem with propane heaters is that they put off moisture in the air. Diesel heater can produce a dry heat (similar to dry heat off a firewood burning).
I learned from this van tour a guy had an SBAR diesel heater and he no longer could tap into his diesel tank once he switched out his van for gasoline. He called up SBAR and they said he could run the heater off Kerosene so he keeps a 3 gallon tank of Kerosene in his van. An advatage apparently to running Kerosene is that it might even be less maintenance. Again that is mentioned in the video below.
AC DC - what to do. Go solar? Keep it simple? Use power only when plugged in? Take a generator?
it'd be great to have solar on the roof, have all the batteries and sinewave convertors / solar charger kind of stuff. That said, if it's not feasible, perhaps a portable power solution could be useful for maybe a couple days worth of powered activity.
Saw a video recently Linus Tech Tips / ShortCircuit did a video on the Jackery solar power stations.
Remember in regards to power, the fancy built in units with all the electronics will always be more expensive than just getting a bunch of batteries and figuring out how to rig them up yourself. But also safer, warrantied etc etc.
There are portable solutions for sinks and counter tops. This is interesting to me because in terms of camping, food preparation, if enough solutions could be stowed well, they don't need to be permanent fixtures in a camper. What if the most important fixture ended up being a shower in the camper? That would be nuts.
There are a few options of toilets. Bucket with toilet-like lid. Cassette, real plumbing with black tank, composting toilet, incinerator toilet. More?
I had this idea to drag a light trailer behind the van to use as storage and toilet. It could have its own solar panel, fan etc. Might be kinda nice for some trips. Others it wouldn't matter.
While it might not be entirely possible, there is a potential in utilizing the existing holes in the frame. The hexagonal holes for example can have hexagonal rivnuts attached to them. 1/4 20 might be OK for fastening but 5/16ths bolts will get you more strength. If a riv nut can support 5/16th, that also means that 80/20 aluminum extrusions in the 1.5 inch would be using matching bolt size.
People discussing how to get more accurate readings from the van, you can install readers into the OBD plug. One system a user had was a KOBRA Wifi OBD2 Scan tool device:
If you need to know more specific readouts from the OBD instead of unreliable temperature, you can get a BT OBD device and get data on a phone, main phone or even a repurposed screen device too.
I hadn't really thought much about this but there's a few drawbacks to having the windows and not being stealthy, the more lke a work van you look, the less likely you'll be bothered by police and others thinking you're “living in a van”
I don't intend to live in the van, but I like the idea of going unnoticed if I'm temporarily staying for fun or by necessity. So here's an example video of some people who decided, no windows, and they hid the solar panels and everything, even hiding the ladder in plain site. Other features he's got a lot of solar, he's got various mold mitigation techniques, he's got solid choices in inverters, has the bathroom and water (40 gallons of water!) and plenty of heated water for showers. in -15 degrees he was living in 70 degrees. Interesting ideas for airflow and just loaded with nice electronics, and using a dog house air conditioner for the bed space. Pretty awesome.
Whoa, revelation today. And it came from an unlikely video of a really annoying guy on youtube. You know those videos that say they're one thing and don't deliver, that kinda guy. BUT!!! Here's the thing. He got me thinking about all sorts of craftiness. Just from the spartan look of his setup. Here's the deal, we get hung up on all the amazing things people build and outfit in their van. But the fact is, they spend 10-40 weeks on it, consuming a lot of time solving problems and losing a lot of flexibility. And they all tend to regret or wish they did different.
So here's ANOTHER way to think about how to build in your van. What can I build that will allow me to repurpose that same thing in my garage. If I'm taking my van somewhere like an overnight, it's likely that I won't be in my garage utilizing say a sawhorse, or some sort of containment unit like a cabinet. How can I make it so these things can be used in the van or garage with nothing lost? And what sort of materials would I use to get away with this aspect?
Here's an example. Saw horses. Saw horses *could* provide the most durable standing, sitting, sleeping platform you could concieve. And they can be stacked and stowed in numerous ways including multiple directions. They can be a bench, a work table, a bed frame. They can be metal, wood and coated with carpet to soften their look. They can have fastener and clamping holes EASILY added, retrofitted in order to secure other things to them. They can be light or heavy, they can be built to stay together, or be completely flat packed.
There may be certain wiring or piping fixtures that work best as completely fitted in. But the idea is that maybe a control center, including certain key appliances *could* be stack-able and removable and toted (if heavy) on wheels in order to store those components in a better place. That could include refrigerator, cooktop, even an electrical system could be made to be easily removable and wheeled away when not in use for a while. This means the entire van build could be modular. You could set a goal to make the entire system break down in under an hour and removable via their own containers or with a typical dolly of a specific weight limit.
Ramps end up being triangle wedges to get stuff off the truck. What if these ramps could be repurposed as storage too stored as opposite inverted rectangle?
Some really interesting ideas can come from soft materials. That includes creating partitions for things like bathroom and shower use. What is a shower really? Water comes from above, and drains below. What if a shower could be something you set up as a quick and even large partition utlizing water-proof materials and a simple drainage and collection technique. Then when completed and used by everyone, put away and even appropriately dried out with a method of sun, or compressed air or suitable hanging method that could prevent mold (blue UV light?)
Strapping mesh with fastened harder fold-able materials to create partitions but being able to leverage strong taught tie fasteners, you could attach or simulate, or realistically create a real wall between the drive cabin and the cargo area, potentially helping with temp control. The strapping also potentially creates a real safety barrier and you're not necessarily limited to one fastening application, several could be tried.
One of the comforts AND potentially best way to clean up in a small area with a bit less stress would be to take a bath in warm water rather than dealing with the limitations of a shower, pumping. A way to heat water might be to get an immersion heater. If you can get, say between 5 and 15 gallon tanks, you can plug in and insert the immersion heater wand and heat say a couple gallons of water in 4-18 minutes, again depending on what you're doing.
Looking at Amazon there are some mixed reviews on the various immersion heaters, but if you combined a bath tub, raised on a platform, which could drain into a gray water tank, insert the immersion heater (if you can plug it in), have a temp gauge in the water to check water temps you may even be able to listen for a beep alert when the water is warm to take a bath. Then once finished, possibly a rinse with another water tank positioned higher up which was also heated.
A heated tank could be insulated as well and a warm bath with a warm rinse all with drainage taken care of could be REALLY comfortable. Potentially if you had filters ready you could filter your gray water back into more clean shower water.
There's a potential use of a bathtub that is made by rubbermaid, and it's for feeding animals or for growing fish in it. Other companies make them too but they are called “Stock Tanks” and if you could heat the water you could use it for a good outdoor bath. They make 100 gal to 400 gal stock tanks. Potentially a stock tank could be used as a bin, or upside down as a support structure for something else. but when the time is right could be used as a bath basin.
basically look at various activities like bathing, toilet, a shower, working with tools and think of ways to set up a rack or a rack with caddies so everything need is available to you. In the case of bathing, you want your cleaning products, clothing, towels, scrubbing and after bath products, say to ensure you are cleaning up the situation. Having a rack and caddie system means you don't have to worry about NOT having what you need.
Ran across this product from all places a CNC channel. Maker Pipe is a company that makes connectors for conduit piping. A guy took the makerpipe and used it for his own roof rack and the pipe is on a hinge and he has his solar panels on top of his makerpipe roofrack and he has them hinged so he can angle his 900 watts of solar at an angle to face the sun. To back up a moment, the original creator of this pipe fitting type I'm referring to here is the Yazaki Kako company in Japan. Creform seems to be one of the larger manufacturer/distributor of this fitting type and others are also doing it in consumer kit form.
Guy fed up with the stereo / backup cam software decided to hack the wire so that he could use a toggle switch to turn on backup camera whenever he wanted.
Picture a bit of conduit in a C shape about 24 inches wide. It folds up or folds down of the wall secured by a cable but has netting within it and even around it. Would provide very light overhead bin storage but when not in use, it practically folds flush. As a net or mesh it secures things by the sag and friction of the net. So when driving the items in the net folded down will be secure. You could also secure it half way using knots in a rope or other method to give it incremental size.
One example of the shape is from boats boats.
Another example is a Luggage train rack w/ netting (expensive and doesn't fold)
So it turns out that the modularity aspect of the van builds was conceived before me, by the VanDoIt people. They are in Greater KC area (Blue Springs) and they build out of the Ford Transit passenger vans. This gives them all the luxury amenities but allows them to take things out.
Things they have covered:
Video of their little build warehouse in Blue Springs - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kP-bMWddWY
playlist - https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLu9l40IymKw9y0wLaZAk_84kgU6p5Rfwi